Friday, March 27, 2020

Shutting Everything Down. . . the dissenting informed voices.

The professor returns to ponder.

I don't want to suggest here that I know what the best approach to combating COVID 19's spread is.  What is clear, at least right now, is that a majority of those who are well informed are taking the view that shutting everything down as much as possible is the correct approach, and this appears to have been the successful approach for China.

Successful?

Yes, I'd say successful.  The disease broke out, but they flattened their curve in a country where the potential death toll was colossal.  Italy has now surpassed China in the death toll, and when we further consider the statistical difference in percentages of the overall population infected and killed in China with Italy, well there's no comparison.  And it looks to be certain that Spain will soon surpass China as well.  The US is frankly likely to, and has already surpassed China in the number of infections, which frankly doesn't surprise me as its much easier to shut the spread of a disease down in a country that has no history of individual freedom whatsoever as compared to one where that is a societal value.

So, anyhow, with the example of a success in front of us, how could anyone doubt the lock down approach?

Well, some days ago here I raised some questions about it in this post here:

The Coronavirus Pandemic and the Free Society


My comments were based on a couple of things, one thing being views I've picked up as a long student of human behavior.  I didn't go after it directly, but I questioned, among other things, our ability to really shut things down.  

Frankly, I've been hugely surprised that American society has in fact shut things down a lot more than I imagined it could.  Indeed, it's been impressive, irrespective of the repeatedly pathetic nature of the current crop of New York politicians who constantly act like scared little girls and whose first instinct is always to blame the Administration. The days of Al Smith, Theodore Roosevelt, and Franklin Roosevelt are clearly long over.

New Yorker Franklin Roosevelt who counselled that "we have nothing to fear, but fear itself", as opposed to current governor of New York Andrew Cuomo and current mayor of New York City, Bill de Blasio, whose apparent motto is "when in trouble or in doubt, run in circles, scream and shout."

At the same time, what I should have been aware would be the case for a society that's gone from valuing individual freedom to abhorring individual self responsibility, there's a fair number of people who view any restriction of any kind as applying only to other people.  I'll avoid going into it in detail but I'm already familiar with a person who was leading the charge on how businesses ought to be planning for shutdowns and had an obligation to have a plan, to pretty much 100% failing to apply the very plan that he urged everyone to adopt, and even arguing that rather brazen violations of it didn't really apply to that person on an individual level.  Things like that are pretty common.  It's sort of a COVID 19 example of the old story who campaigns for personal morality and is later arrested in an opium den attempting to procure the services of a lady of doubtful virtue.

Indeed, example of this already abound in the closure orders we've seen imposed here and there.  Nobody's closure orders that I'm aware of shut down liquor stores even though, save for alcoholics, they aren't a critical business of any kind. Colorado, having encouraged a generation to become marijuana addicts, left their weed dumps open as they really can't close them.  These are examples of a certain species of societal hypocrisy, particularly the latter, which involves impairing your lungs to start with, and we know it.  We just close a blind eye as even though we can imagine closing corner news stands, lest the literate congregate and get COVID 19, we can't imagine closing pot shops where the doped up with impaired lungs will definitely congregate.

Anyhow, what I didn't directly address in print, but something I've known about, is what infectious disease specialist call "herd immunity".  I wasn't aware that is what it was called, but I was aware of it.

Cattle.  Apparently longhorns, in the foreground, believe in self isolating rather than herd immunity.

What herd immunity is that state which is achieved when a sufficiently large percentage of a population becomes immune to a disease sot hat it can no longer effectively be transmitted.  That is 100% of the population, but it's a high percentage, such as 70%. 

All viral diseases of this type are in the end defeated by herd immunity. What occurs, in a state of nature, is that sooner or later almost all of the "herd" are infected and the survivors now have immunity.  At that point, the few members of the heard that escaped being infected have very low risk of infection.

An example of that would be that of the 1918-19 Flu.  It was a pandemic, such as that which we are currently experiencing, and there was no way to immunize for it at the time.  It cycled the globe twice, or perhaps even three times (it may have in fact evolved during its first trip around the globe as it seems to have gone from bad to really deadly in that trip).  But by 1919 so many human beings had it that it just petered out.  The virus in the 18/19 form still exists, it just doesn't do much due to the oddly inherited immunity that human populations pass on for certain viruses.  We have, therefore, herd immunity to that version of the flu.

Now, I've used the term "state of nature" here as there is another way to achieve "herd immunity" and that's artificially.

This in fact was understood well before viruses were known of.  Smallpox, for example, was endemic in the human population due to the two smallpox viruses that transmit it and in the 18th Century vaccination with live vaccines, which is very risky, was known to be effective.  For this reason, when there were large numbers of people at risk of smallpox it was common for people to seek immunization, even though it was in fact a very risky thing to do.

Something that hasn't been explained much about "flattening the curve" of COVID 19 is that it depends on the combined impact of herd immunity with the expectation of a vaccine. So, if we flatten it enough, by next year, probably, we will probably have a vaccine and, for those who are getting infected, maybe effective antivirals for it.  So while most who speak of flattening the curve simply speak o in terms of leaving resources open, some also discuss this. The hope is not to be overwhelmed, and, as the same time, buy time for a vaccine.

Makes sense.

But a few people hold the opposite view.

I first read of this a few days ago when a relative linked in an article from the Atlantic.

Let me first say here that I generally, but  not always, like the the Atlantic, but Coronavirus reporting demonstrates the usual thing most reporting does, which is writers know how to write but they don't generally know very much about anything else.  This has made much of the pandemic reporting wildly wild and of little practical content, unfortunate.

Anyhow, the article ironically went after President Trump and the New York Times, or more accurately a New York Times columnist for being "right wing" individuals who were weighing in economic concerns more than human ones.

The NYT Columnist is Thomas L. Friedman who has probably never before been called a right wing conservative in his entire life.  If Friedman is right wing, Bernie Sanders is a flaming conservative, and Andrew Yang a charter member of the Young Republicans.  The Atlantic should be ashamed of itself.

Friedman is an original thinker, however, and says some really uncomfortable things.  I'm not endorsing his views on anything, but I am noting that he's definitely not a conservative.  Anyhow, the column that the Atlantic referred to by Friedman was called:

Some experts say it can be done in weeks, not months — and the economy and public health are at stake.

Frieman admits in the column that he's not claiming to know what's best. Rather, he was riffing off an earlier NYT Op-ed.  Friedman noted:
And Friedman is definitely right that there's a lot of "group think" going on.

Indeed, no matter what, I think the group think is now so strong that we're going down the close everything down route no matter what.

Anyhow, Friedman was referring to another article by a Dr. Katz, entitled:


There may be more targeted ways to beat the pandemic.
Dr. Katz is a bold man, we have to admit, and he's taking some heat for his opinion.  But his opinion is basically what I pondered last week.

Dr. Katz feels that the real strategy is to isolate the highly at risk and then let the disease cycle through everyone else.  Isolate those whose health and age cause the real risks and the go back to life as normal. Don't close anything, except as noted.  We'll achieve herd immunity quickly, and the whole thing will be over.

Now Dr. Katz also makes some negative assumptions. That is, he claims we don't know a lot of things so we just shouldn't plan for them. We don't know the death rate, for example, so we shouldn't assume that its as high as claimed. 

This gets into the paradox of knowing what we don't know, which is something that most people don't grasp and which is outside of the common understanding that "you can't know what you don't know".  You can, and in fact do, know what you don't know. That is, you know where your knowledge is lacking and incomplete.  Dr. Katz argues that wall we really know is who is very much at risk and who isn't, and we should isolate the former and the latter should charge on, so we achieve herd immunity quickly. At the same time, he argues we will likewise avoid destroying the economy and, he suggests, a destroyed economy has its own health risks.

The latter comment is completely true, no matter what people might like to claim.  People out of work over a prolonged time don't do well with a lot of things, including health.  People turn to drugs and alcohol, and people at home, desperate, with nothing to do, turn to violence as well.  Employees of universities spending their paid quarantines in their apartments might not, but then they're paid and have something to do.  Not everybody is in that class by a longshot.

Dr. Katz has received a lot of criticism for his op-ed, not surprisingly.  And he may flat out be wrong.  The death rate we don't know might turn out to be higher, perhaps a lot higher, than we thought it was.  And maybe the at risk population is a lot broader than we thought it was.  Perhaps the Chinese example is a bad one as their social control kept us from knowing what would happen in a broader epidemic.  The example of Italy gives us a lot of reason to suspect all of these things.  In that case, Katz's gamble would be a disaster.

Beyond that, by this point, the ball is rolling so fast that it's probably too darned late to call a big time out really.  Every day a neighboring state here completely closes down and at this point I'll actually be surprised if our state doesn't.

But that doesn't mean that some serious pondering isn't in order.  The longer things go on the worse the economy will be and at some point that becomes a wider and wider societal disaster.  And it also becomes one that's harder and harder to climb out of.  The government is just going to create money to try to float the economy out of thin air as it is, with very little thought to what that even does to the economy.  

Maybe this is the exactly correct thing to do as its the only way to save lives.  But simply wondering if it is or isn't, isn't necessarily unwarranted.

Something to ponder.

Friday Farming: How does this happen?

March 27, 1920. Germany's Treaty Violations noted, Borah says something about Wood, maybe.

On this day in 1920 the German civil war in regions left inside the Versailles Treaties prohibition on German military power continued on in rebellion. Both the Ruhr and Westphalia had seen armed worker revolts as a result of the Kapp Putsch and now neither region's labor fighters were willing to stand down and instead were trying to take German in a more leftward direction.  The Allies, however, wouldn't agree to let the German Army in.

On the same day, Germany was found to have violated the Treaty, which in fact was pretty obvious.  Germany had been limited to 204 artillery pieces and was prohibited to have aircraft, but in fact, through the help of the quasi official but technically civilian Freikorps, it had 12,000 artillery pieces and 6,000 aircraft.

The size limitations placed on the German military were never realistic, no matter what a person otherwise thinks of the Versailles Treaty. Indeed, the Weimar Republic had no choice but to violate them.  Realistically, the only alternative the Allies had to allowing Germany to have a fairly sizable military would have been to actually occupy the country, as it did following World War Two.  As it was, Germany was left a functioning, albeit barely, republican state that had to contend with internal revolution as well as a very unstable situation in the immediate post war world to its east.  Those concerns practically necessitated the retention of artillery and aircraft.

Their prohibition and the very early incentive to avoid that prohibition, which in part was done through the reliance on right wing monarchical militias help fuel a sense of resentment in the military which would later help bring about the Second World War.  It was certainly not solely responsible for it by any means, but it was an element of that.

On the same day the Cheyenne State Leader opted for a nearly nonsensical primary election headline.


Apparently that meant that highly respected Senator Borah of Idaho was taking some swipes at leading GOP Presidential contender, General Leonard Wood.

Elsewhere, on this Saturday, people went shopping.


Today In Wyoming's History: March 26, 2020. The Governor of Montana issues a Stay At Home Order

Today In Wyoming's History: March 26:2020

2020  The Governor of Montana joined other Wyoming neighbors Idaho and
Colorado and issued a shelter in place order for his state.  The press
release on the order stated:
Governor Bullock Issues Stay at Home Directive to Slow the Spread of COVID-19
Directive asks Montanans to stay home to maximum extent possible except for
essential activities, temporarily restricts all nonessential businesses
and operations
MONTANA
– Governor Steve Bullock today issued a Directive requiring Montanans to stay home and temporarily closes all nonessential businesses and operations to curtail the spread of COVID-19. The order, which goes into effect at 12:01 a.m. on March 28, will buy time for health care workers on the front lines and seeks to limit long term impacts to the state’s economy.
“In consultation with public health experts, health care providers, and emergency management professionals, I have determined that to protect public health and human safety, it is essential, to the maximum extent possible, individuals stay at home or at their place of residence,” said Governor Bullock. “There’s no doubt that COVID-19 is causing a lot of hardship. It’s also causing incredible hardships for our front line doctors, nurses and other hospital staff across the country.”
The Directive will be in effect through Friday, April 10 and requires all businesses and operations in Montana, except for essential businesses and operations as defined in the directive, to stop all activities within the state.
The Directive also prohibits all public and private gatherings of any number of people occurring outside a household or place of residence.
“I am taking these measures today because we need to stay in front of this pandemic and slow the growth of infections. In order to have a healthy economy we need a healthy population. We cannot rebuild our economic strength without doing everything we can now to flatten the curve and slow the spread of this virus,” continued Governor Bullock.
Essential services and businesses will remain operational and open. Businesses deemed essential are required to comply with social distancing guidelines when possible including maintaining six feet of distance, having sanitizing products available, and designating hours of operation specifically for vulnerable populations.
Under the directive, Montanans may leave their homes for essential activities, including:
  • For health and safety. To engage in activities or perform tasks essential  to their health and safety, or to the health and safety of their family  or household members (including, but not limited to, pets), such as, by  way of example only and without limitation, seeking emergency services,  obtaining medical supplies or medication, or visiting a health care  professional. 
  • For necessary supplies and services. To obtain necessary services or  supplies for themselves and their family or household members, or to  deliver those services or supplies to others, such as, by way of example only and without limitation, groceries and food, household consumer  products, supplies they need to work from home, and products necessary  to maintain the safety, sanitation, and essential operation of  residences 
  • For outdoor activity. To engage in outdoor activity, provided the  individuals comply with social distancing, as defined below, such as, by way of example and without limitation, walking, hiking, running, or  biking. Individuals may go to public parks and open outdoor recreation  areas, including public lands in Montana provided they remain open to  recreation. Montanans are discouraged from outdoor recreation activities that pose enhanced risks of injury or could otherwise stress the  ability of local first responders to address the COVID-19 emergency (e.g., backcountry skiing in a manner inconsistent with avalanche recommendations or in closed terrain).
  • For certain types of work. To perform work providing essential products and services at Essential Businesses or Operations or to otherwise carry  out activities specifically permitted in this Directive, including  Minimum Basic Operations. 
  • To take care of others. To care for a family member, friend, or pet in  another household, and to transport family members, friends, or pets as  allowed by this Directive.
The attached  Directive follows federal guidance to determine the businesses and
operations deemed essential, which are summarized in the Directive and  can also be found here: https://www.cisa.gov/publication/guidance-essential-critical-infrastructure-workforce [cisa.gov].
Businesses with questions can contact a dedicated state line at 1-800-755-6672 and
leave messages 24-hours a day and will receive a prompt response.

Thursday, March 26, 2020

Today In Wyoming's History: March 25, 2020. Staying At Home, Orders and Suggestions.

Today In Wyoming's History: March 25:2020

2020  Governor Gordon suggested Wyomingites stay at home.  The states press release stated:
Governor
Gordon, top officials call for all Wyoming citizens to stay home
CHEYENNE, Wyo. – Governor Mark Gordon issued a plea to Wyomingites to stay home to slow the spread of the coronavirus (COVID-19) pandemic during a press conference today.
“I am here today to urge Wyoming citizens to stay home whenever possible, only going out when absolutely necessary,” Gov. Gordon said. “It is imperative to flatten the curve by staying home.”
The governor emphasized the need for public cooperation in order for Wyoming to make strides in slowing the spread of the virus. Public participation could alleviate the need to implement more stringent measures, he added
“Your voluntary actions and discipline are going to make the difference as to whether we can slow the spread of COVID-19. You can make a difference in Wyoming for you, your family and your neighbors,” Gov. Gordon said. “We must keep our hospital facilities functional, not just for COVID-19 but to help people with regular health emergencies like a stroke or a broken leg.”
Additional sample collection kits developed by the Wyoming Department of Health will be distributed to counties later this week, increasing testing capabilities. As of March 25, there are 44 confirmed cases of COVID-19 in 10 Wyoming counties. More robust testing data is also available on the Department of Health’s website.
“We need to take the Governor’s words seriously,” said Mike Ceballos, Director of the Wyoming Department of Health. “The orders Wyoming has in place are intended to keep people separated so the virus has limited opportunity to spread. It is most important to stay at home as much as possible. If we work together, we will be able to reduce illness and the burden on our health care system.”
Wyoming Secretary of State Ed Buchanan reinforced the state’s essential role in meeting public needs and protecting public safety.
“Wyoming citizens deserve continued public service, and we are working to protect our most vulnerable populations - people who are sick, have disabilities or who are elderly - as well as our employees who are providing those services,” Buchanan said. “My task force will continue to work with local governments and our tribal nations across the state, giving them what they need to serve people and stay safe.”
Wyoming Department of Workforce Services Director Robin Cooley provided an update on the agency's efforts to expand call capacity to meet public demand. The agency is continuing its efforts to streamline unemployment benefit applications. Currently, unemployment claims are being processed within 2 days from the date of filing with no waiting period.
“We stand ready to help businesses and employees,” Director Cooley said. “Employers are still hiring and workers are still looking for jobs.”
First Lady Jennie Gordon has mobilized her Wyoming Hunger Initiative to specifically address challenges created by COVID-19 and help keep Wyoming residents fed. Today, the first lady launched a one-stop-shop for food resources in every county in Wyoming. Further, Wyoming Food Bank of the Rockies will be offering mobile food pantry sites starting next week in Worland on March 31, Torrington on April 1, Star Valley on April 2 and Evanston on April 3. More sites will be announced in the coming days.
Gov. Gordon continues to meet regularly with the Wyoming Department of Health and other stakeholders to assess the impacts of COVID-19 on Wyoming’s communities.
Additional guidance for schools districts, state agencies, businesses and public spaces will be updated by the end of the week.
Additional COVID-19 resources are available at the state of Wyoming's COVID-19 website,
In issuing this recommendation, the Governor did not make it an order.  However, by this date, two of Wyoming's neighbors, Colorado and Idaho, had done just that. Colorado's order provided:
CENTENNIAL - Today Gov. Polis announced a statewide stay-at-home order beginning on Thursday, March 26 at 6:00 a.m. and will last until April 11, 2020. The Governor also provided an update on the state’s response to COVID-19 and actions taken to limit the spread of the virus. 
“Coloradans are living through a global pandemic and this decision was made to help save lives,” said Governor Jared Polis. “We will continue doing everything we can to get the resources Colorado needs to address COVID-19 and protect the health and safety of all Coloradans. In true Colorado spirit, we’re seeing our friends, family and neighbors rise to the challenge, donating their time, money or extra supplies to support relief efforts at the state and local levels. We are in this together and this is the season to stay at home to save lives.” 
This executive order means Coloradans should not be leaving their homes except for critical activities including: 
  • Obtaining food and other household necessities including medicine
  • Going to and from work if you are a critical employee
  • Seeking medical care
  • Caring for dependents or pets
  • Caring for a vulnerable person in another location
  • Cannabis and liquor stores will remain open 
  • Or participating in outdoor recreation at a legally-mandated safe distance of six feet or more from other parties
Read the full order here. Read the FAQ here. Read the public health order here. Watch the press conference here
Colorado continues facing a shortage of resources in addressing this pandemic, which is why the Governor sent a letter to the Trump administration urging the president to declare a Major Disaster for the State of Colorado. A major disaster declaration would free up resources for medical care, housing, unemployment assistance, crisis counseling, hazard mitigation and more. California, Washington and New York have received these declarations. Read the request here. 
While the state is facing a shortage of resources, Coloradans are stepping up to try and fill the gap. More than 7,000 Coloradans have already signed up to volunteer on www.helpcoloradonow.org, nearly 1,300 of which have medical training. The Colorado COVID Relief Fund has also raised more than $7 million since launching late last
week. 
Gov. Polis requested and received dual-status commander authority to ensure unity of command, allowing regular, federal military units to be controlled by a single commander representing the Governor. This will help to eliminate confusion and conflict and allow the state to streamline the utilization of military personnel in this response.
The Governor announced that the state lab has eliminated its backlog and there will be new labs coming online at the University of Colorado, Colorado State University, University Hospital, and Children’s Hospital. The Governor thanked CSU and CU for their willingness to test the personal protective equipment the private sector
is ramping up that the state needs now. 
Governor Polis also provided an update on the federal stimulus package which included $377 billion for small business loans and grants, $1200 in direct cash assistance to Americans based on income
eligibility.
The Governor also provided an update on the Innovation Response Team, introducing two new members: Lucy Sanders and Tim Miller. Lucy is the CEO and a co-founder of the National Center for Women & Information Technology and will head up Isolation Services. The objective is to provide people who are in self-isolation or home
quarantine with critical supplies like food and access to health care, and also ancillary services to make their at-home experience as comfortable as possible. Tim Miller is the Chairman and Chief Executive Officer of Rally Software and will head the Software Development Team.
The objective is to build applications and web sites for both government and citizens to manage all aspects of the crisis, and provide the state with key data. 
The Governor also noted that the Innovation Response Team is working as hard as they can to identify manufacturers and supply chains, but urged the private sector to help in this effort.

March 26, 1920. Reichwehr and the Ruhr. F. Scott Fitzgerald and This Side Of Paradise.

In Germany, the rebellion in the Ruhr raged on, and the German government asked for permission to cross into the Ruhr to fight the Reds there. They wouldn't receive permission, but it didn't stop them from advancing into the Ruhr anyhow.

In the U.S., Fitzgerald's This Side Of Paradise went into publication.


A critical success, the novel put Fitzgerald on the map and it achieved his personal goal of convincing Zelda Sayre to marry him. Fitzgerald, a Princeton student only shortly before, had begun work in earnest on the project when she left him. 

The novel is set in Princeton, which didn't impress the President of Princeton at all, as he found its depiction of student lives to be dispiriting and non academic.

Washington D.C. National Guard, March 26, 1920.

Wet Markets. SARS, MERS, COVID 19, Pandemics. This will surely draw rebuke, and

perhaps it should, which doesn't mean it's not without a point.

A couple of days ago, Hua Chunying, a Chinese spokesman, posted a frustrated post in regard to stories accusing the Chinese of delaying supplying information regarding COVID 19 to the world.

I don't know how quickly China altered other nations, but the country is insular by nature.  Did the warning come soon enough?  I don't know that it would have mattered if it came any sooner.  It might have, or it might not have. The key, really, was Chinese lunar new year, which spread the disease all around China, and around the globe.  Chinese lunar new year this year was January 25.

Anyhow, there's some good evidence that the US was aware of early warnings on the disease and somewhat disregarded them, in spite of intelligence warnings.  Be that as it may, it's interesting to note that the first thing that the US did in response to the epidemic, as it was at that time, was to ban travel from China.

Which resulted in the Administration getting criticism that it was being typically draconian and overreacting.  We now know that was precisely the right thing to do, but it didn't go far enough.  Maybe nothing would have worked, but at the same time, given the realities of global travel, the Administration really should have banned incoming travel from anywhere, which would have seen, up until about three weeks ago, draconian in the extreme.

Anyhow, Hua Chunying's frustrated Twitter received a reply from Liz Cheney. The exchange is below.

Liz Cheney
@Liz_Cheney
How about you stop eating bats. Seriously.
Quote Tweet
Hua Chunying 华春莹
@SpokespersonCHN
·
China has been updating the US on the coronavirus and its response since Jan. 3. On Jan. 15 the US State Department notified Americans in China US CDC's warning about the coronavirus. And now blame China for delay? Seriously?
8:47 PM · Mar 20, 2020Twitter for iPhone
Actually, it's pretty unlikely that the coronavirus jumped from bats to human beings through a bowl of bat soup.

But it does appear to have jumped from bats to people in a wet market, and something really does need to be done about that.  A wet market is a market in which live animals are sold for consumption.

Now, I'm not going to go all full bore fanatic on this the way some, as in if it isn't done in my culture it shouldn't be done. But wet markets are a real anachronism that really ought to go in general.  Crowing ducks, chickens, pigs etc. etc., live in a densely populated city is just asking for trouble, and trouble we now have.  We've known this forever.

Indeed, wet markets once existed all over the world, but in the western world they've mostly ceased.  Mexico, I believe, still has wet markets, but it's an exception in the northern hemisphere of  the Americas, and they ought to stop it as well.  Its not that I think people shouldn't eat ducks, chickens, pigs, etc., but packing them in like this is a really bad idea.  And mixing them in with wild animals that have had no close care (assuming that in Asia domestic animals do, which is another topic entirely), is a really bad idea.  Eating wild animals is fine, if they're in the range of animals that people eat (which some of the things in  Chinese markets are not), but they should be procured directly in the wild.

Put another way, would you want deer from Wyoming, which are exhibiting a terrible Chronic Wasting Disease outbreak, shoved into a pen, live, next to a pig, and sold downtown in your city?

I didn't think so.

And maybe some in Asia is actually now being done, although its not enough.  China banned the sale of wild animals at wet markets on January 1, 2020, fourteen days prior to the event noticed above, but clearly after they knew that they had a real problem.  Wet markets in general ought to entirely go, but that's a step in the right direction.

There's an interesting cultural angle at work here that absolutely prohibits Western nations from criticizing anything about non western ones, while at the same time westerners are free to demand that other westerners stop their own long held practices.  Indeed, this exchange provoked the expected replies.  An example is here:

Replying to
@Liz_Cheney
That’s impressively racist, even graded on the GOP bigotry curve.

No, it's not racist at all.

The Chinese and other Asian "wet" markets are ideal breeding grounds for the communication and jump of viruses from animals to humans.  They simply are. There's a reason that nearly every new version of the flu comes out of Asia, and it isn't because the flu vacations there.  The flu is a real killer, and Asian conditions are the ideal breeding ground for it.   The Chinese themselves may have finally taken the first step to stopping this, although it doesn't go far enough.

And in recent years, it hasn't just been the flu.  The prequel to COVID 19 was SARS and SARS 2, which is another coronavirus.  It's still around, but it seems to have been brought under control.  It seems, also, to have pretty much the same type of origin as COVID 19, with bats as its donor, but with civet cats in the transmission chain.

The third big one in recent years is MERS.  It doesn't have an Asian origin, but rather a Middle Eastern one.

Source of the virus


From the World Health Organization.

Okay, why does this matter? Well let's consider a comment from the Lancet regarding MERS:

Stopping the disease will be best achieved by prevention at the source. Like John Snow, who removed the handle of the water pump on Broad Street following the cholera outbreak in London, public health officials need to find the key lever at the sources of disease through a greater understanding of the enzootic patterns.

The long and the short of it is that things like this likely broke out in these locations repeatedly in the past.  Humans in those regions were lucky in that none of them were as deadly as the Great Plague, which broke out in Europe due to the vile conditions in Medieval cities.  But of note there, the Plague doesn't break out anymore as people don't let the conditions that cause it arise.

The Chinese were doing little, or at least not enough about the situation which has given rise to this, until the outbreak occurred. They knew exactly where to go, and that it was the "wet market".

A wet market slaughters meat right on the spot.  No USDA veterinarians inspecting the facilities in that instance.  And the Chinese retain a fondness for exotic foods that are often eaten due to folklore.  Bats caught wherever bats are caught and brought right into the market with Bat Funk.

Indeed, common sense would lead you to the conclusion bats aren't food.  Eating a bat basically violates the cardinal rule of omnivores and predators that they don't eat each other.  It's not safe.  Wolves don't eat coyotes, lions don't eat hyenas.  You get the picture.  People eating bats is, frankly, flat out weird and ought to stop.

But this is only part of the strange Chinese table demand, which retains a lot of folk items that are consumed on demonstratively false assumptions about them, including species that shouldn't be eaten at all as they're a danger to humans.

And as noted, we'd have a fit if there was a downtown market with deer hauled freshly off the range this morning shoved into a pen next to pigs and chickens.  And we indeed should, that wouldn't be safe.

Thousands will now die all over the globe due to this.  And if we include SARS and SARS 2, this is the third time in recent years, excluding all the version of the flu that come out of Asia, that this has occurred.  With the rapid speed of modern transportation, every local epidemic will now become a pandemic.

Now, the largest wet markets in the world are closed as to the sale of wild animals, but they aren't closed.  Closing them would be swimming massively against the cultural tide, but it is something that has disappeared in the West.  Indeed, if it was suggested we reopen them here, there'd be howls of protests from the same classes that protest that noting the Chinese situation is somehow inappropriate.  And indeed, telling others what they can and cannot eat, and can and cannot do is something that we should always think twice about.  But here's an example of where something really needs to change.